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[Music]

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um

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[Music]

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now you're electrifying hosts of

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exploring the bazaar

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oh ezekiel saw that wheel way

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up in the middle of the air ezekiel saw

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that wheel

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whirling way up in the middle of the air

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now the little wheel runs by faith and

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the big

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wheel runs by the grace of god and a

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wheel in a wheel

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whirling way up in the middle of the air

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wow tim now that's impressive

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were you training to sing gospels you

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should be in the choir

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and then they put me in the back row

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away from the

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microphone i was an alto i suppose

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i just like the feel of good church

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music it gets my soul going and my feet

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are tapping

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well i guess this uh particular song has

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a special meaning since

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it's about ezekiel's wheel within a

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wheel

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which you know a lot of people think is

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about ufos in the bible

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well i suppose that could be the case

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our guest tonight might be

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more informed than on this uh than we

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are

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tim oh a wheel in a wheel i feel like

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the angels might be about to

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take me away boy

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you have to be kidding you

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and angels okay that's up to debate but

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uh

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before this old time ufo takes us away

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let's get back to the

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kcor studios and get on with the show as

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we have a very special

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guest and a good friend to spend the

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next hour with

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oh ezekiel saw that wheel way

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up in the middle of the air

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hallelujah hallelujah hallelujah tim

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hallelujah

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to all our listeners out there i've made

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and glad that you're back oh man we had

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we had a rough time

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but i do want to thank the listeners and

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our facebook friends who

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sent me first birthday wishes and then

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when they found out that i was in the

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hospital

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on my birthday they sent me good will

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gift

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hell they just said hello i don't know

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but then you know when i when i finally

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spit from that split from the hospital

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and no i did not have the the virus

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it was just my my ticker uh i guess you

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could

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couple of days and uh went up to

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uh woodstock with uh our friends uh

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cersei and then maria de andrea

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and we had a heck of a good time and uh

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ate like

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the champions that we are but we're not

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here to talk about food or

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uh my health uh we're here to talk to a

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good friend

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of ours and a um

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a compatriot a companion in our

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in deeds of publishing uh some of the

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best

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material in the world so why don't you

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introduce our guests

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that will be my pleasure tim well uh our

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guest tonight is sean casteel now this

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is not the first time that uh

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sean has been on our show but it's been

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too long

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a time since he's had a chance to talk

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with us

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now sean is a freelance journalist who's

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been writing about ufos alien abduction

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and

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other paranormal subjects since 1989.

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now shawn's writing has appeared in many

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ufo and paranormal related magazines

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including

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ufo magazine tim beckley's ufo universe

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fate mysteries mag and open open minds

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magazine

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most students now unfortunately are

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defunct but were a major part of the

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thriving ufo press

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in their heydays now magazines in the uk

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italy romania and australia have uh

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also published sean's work which uh

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fortunately there's uh

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at least uh one i think in australia

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about the only english language ufo

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making no no that's that that folded

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that folded to uh uh well no there's the

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the lady that we've had on the show they

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do yeah yeah i'm sorry yes

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and then italy uh there's a big glossy

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magazine in italy i think it's just

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called x

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uh i can't read the articles but uh

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they've published quite a few of

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sean's uh works a very uh glossy uh

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magazine so uh

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well it's it's not the subject so much

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it is of course the

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uh uh form has just got

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got into history i mean it's just the

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thing of the past which is unfortunate

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because

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give me a good pulp magazine and i'm

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well now as sean has written or

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contributed to over 30 books uh for uh

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global communications and interlight

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publications and

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some of his books include the heretics

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ufo guidebook

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which analyzes a selection of gnostic

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christian writings and their

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relationship

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to the ufo phenomena signs and symbols

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of the second coming

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which he interviews several religious

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and paranormal experts

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about how prophecies of the second

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coming of christ may be fulfilled

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and his most recent book which we'll be

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talking about tonight

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ufos armageddon and biblical revelations

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signs symbols and wonders the whole

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truth so sean

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welcome back to exploring the bazaar

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thanks tim great to be here great to be

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here

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well you know sean i want to ask a

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question we

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as you heard my my singing debut here uh

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earlier

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uh what do you make of that gospel

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thought song i mean

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uh do you see that as being about the

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ezekiel's

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a ufo sighting do you consider that a uh

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out of the the bible a legitimate report

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of a unidentified flying object

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yeah i think the report in the book of

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ezekiel is is an accurate uh

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account to see in a ufo uh i don't think

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there's any real doubt about that um and

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then the uh the song the spiritual song

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that you were singing is is certainly a

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an enlightened approach to to the god of

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the old testament

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you know the idea of uh of a

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supernatural

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powerful god not just uh you know a

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voice raining down judgment from on high

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but

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you can actually communicate with

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now i i i'm a little

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kind of kind of confused about your

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background i i've known you for a long

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time and

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you are a prolific writer and you're

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able to capture the

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moment and and write on any topic but

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i also know you as a a person of uh

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of faith how do you combine

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or or correlate the the ufo phenomena

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uh with the with bit of a biblical

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approach because

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most of christians uh and i assume that

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you're a christian i don't know exactly

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what your

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faith background is uh would consider

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ufos the work of the uh of the devil

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well it's interesting that you would say

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that um i first

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learned about whitley's book communion

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when i was reading a christian newspaper

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called prophecy in the news

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and and at that time whitley's book was

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the best salary it was causing lots of

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controversy

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you know not just among ufo believers

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but among religious

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uh people and and the public in general

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it was like number one on the new york

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times best-selling list

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it was a lot of people a lot of people

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were talking about it

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so like i said i read about it in this

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christian newspaper i was reading at the

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time i was a

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regular subscriber to called prophecy in

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the news

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and i gave a very negative review of

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whitley's book they said it clearly was

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demonic and they presented all this uh

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christian uh uh logic and so forth

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that's why it could only be demonic

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so i kind of fouled that away i didn't

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really think too much about it

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and then it was a cold winter day in

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january 1989.

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i took my wife and my daughter to the

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library on a sunday afternoon there was

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nothing else to do on a sunday afternoon

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and the book communion is on the shelf

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there

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this is about a year and a half after it

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after it had been out

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and that community was on the cells

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there so i checked it out just sort of

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out of lark just out of this mild little

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moment of curiosity

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and of course once i started reading it

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i mean it just just opened a whole new

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reality to me

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again i'm sorry about that cough okay

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it opened a whole new reality to me and

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i did not think it was demonic at all

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i i i guess my reasons for saying that

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are complicated

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but uh i i i felt like i had shared some

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of those same experiences

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as willie strieber had i'd experienced

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some of the same fears some of the same

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kind of you know

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terrors of the unknown but i still felt

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it was

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kind of positive

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uh impact i mean it's starting to be

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more angelic than demonic

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i wish i could quote something more

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specifically yes

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well that that gets the uh the point

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across now you

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you say you you had certain things

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happen to you is as

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well that pointed you in in this

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direction

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right yeah yeah i mean i i had um

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you know yeah they talk a lot about

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screen memories about the idea that you

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don't

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heart you rarely remember what actually

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happened

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you remember what they want you to

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remember happened

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but i did have some definite experiences

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when i was uh in my late teens

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when i felt i was speaking

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telepathically was with an intelligent

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uh

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other kind of being wow with these black

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eyes and everything and

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and you know it's one of those again one

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of those experiences where you don't

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totally understand it you just sort of

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follow it away as an unknown

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which again may be an alien induced

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thing they may intend for people to do

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that

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to take a mild interest in what's going

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on but to also accept it

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on such a calm level that it doesn't

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really disrupt your life

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you're able to sort of file it away and

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live with it whatever it was

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00:10:52,630 --> 00:10:49,839
so you you over the the course of uh

285
00:10:54,470 --> 00:10:52,640
of the years have have become a close uh

286
00:10:58,230 --> 00:10:54,480
friends uh with the whitley uh

287
00:11:01,590 --> 00:10:58,240
grieber and uh the late bud hopkins and

288
00:11:04,630 --> 00:11:01,600
and betty uh andreas and uh uh

289
00:11:07,030 --> 00:11:04,640
luca and so you and

290
00:11:08,710 --> 00:11:07,040
reverend barry downing to some uh degree

291
00:11:09,509 --> 00:11:08,720
and you you've written on this as well

292
00:11:12,069 --> 00:11:09,519
as

293
00:11:13,590 --> 00:11:12,079
my good a multitude of topics i i don't

294
00:11:15,670 --> 00:11:13,600
think that there's very much

295
00:11:17,190 --> 00:11:15,680
we haven't hit on but every time i say

296
00:11:18,230 --> 00:11:17,200
that i come up with something different

297
00:11:20,870 --> 00:11:18,240
to do right

298
00:11:22,310 --> 00:11:20,880
i've never never seen my amazon page

299
00:11:24,710 --> 00:11:22,320
about you tim i said you gave me an

300
00:11:26,710 --> 00:11:24,720
education in so many things

301
00:11:27,990 --> 00:11:26,720
just by signing books and articles about

302
00:11:30,790 --> 00:11:28,000
so many subjects that i knew

303
00:11:31,990 --> 00:11:30,800
nothing about yes so in order to write

304
00:11:33,750 --> 00:11:32,000
for you would have to go out and learn

305
00:11:35,190 --> 00:11:33,760
all about this stuff

306
00:11:36,790 --> 00:11:35,200
and along the way of course i got here i

307
00:11:39,670 --> 00:11:36,800
got a real education to him and

308
00:11:40,230 --> 00:11:39,680
you you well you you you certainly have

309
00:11:42,389 --> 00:11:40,240
and

310
00:11:43,829 --> 00:11:42,399
you've become you know certainly one of

311
00:11:46,150 --> 00:11:43,839
the top uh research

312
00:11:48,230 --> 00:11:46,160
writers in the uh i would say the the

313
00:11:50,790 --> 00:11:48,240
world never mind just the uh the country

314
00:11:51,990 --> 00:11:50,800
okay so you you've got you you you've

315
00:11:54,069 --> 00:11:52,000
got this uh

316
00:11:55,110 --> 00:11:54,079
feeling that something strange took

317
00:11:57,990 --> 00:11:55,120
place in your life

318
00:11:58,870 --> 00:11:58,000
you read the communion and you're uh off

319
00:12:02,069 --> 00:11:58,880
and uh

320
00:12:03,990 --> 00:12:02,079
running how did that uh and and later on

321
00:12:06,870 --> 00:12:04,000
you met whitley and you uh

322
00:12:09,190 --> 00:12:06,880
spoke with uh i'm sorry uh you met bud

323
00:12:11,269 --> 00:12:09,200
and you spoke with um

324
00:12:12,470 --> 00:12:11,279
betty uh andreas and luca and her

325
00:12:16,310 --> 00:12:12,480
husband uh

326
00:12:18,470 --> 00:12:16,320
how did this uh affect your uh belief

327
00:12:20,470 --> 00:12:18,480
system i mean it must have had some

328
00:12:24,069 --> 00:12:20,480
impact on on it because

329
00:12:25,829 --> 00:12:24,079
you write about heretics

330
00:12:27,350 --> 00:12:25,839
right but it kind of puts you in the

331
00:12:29,509 --> 00:12:27,360
category it kind of puts you in the

332
00:12:30,949 --> 00:12:29,519
category of one does it not

333
00:12:32,710 --> 00:12:30,959
well i mean i don't know if it puts me

334
00:12:35,190 --> 00:12:32,720
in the category of being a heretic

335
00:12:35,750 --> 00:12:35,200
which would not bother me by the way yes

336
00:12:37,670 --> 00:12:35,760
okay

337
00:12:38,949 --> 00:12:37,680
all a heretic means is that you differ

338
00:12:42,389 --> 00:12:38,959
from the norm

339
00:12:45,269 --> 00:12:42,399
yes that's correct yes but of course the

340
00:12:46,710 --> 00:12:45,279
the regular um religious the the

341
00:12:49,110 --> 00:12:46,720
orthodox religions

342
00:12:50,870 --> 00:12:49,120
would would say that a heretic is like

343
00:12:54,069 --> 00:12:50,880
going against the gods uh

344
00:12:56,069 --> 00:12:54,079
a word i mean they certainly uh uh would

345
00:12:57,269 --> 00:12:56,079
think that uh any of this uh first of

346
00:12:58,790 --> 00:12:57,279
all most of them i don't even know if

347
00:13:00,550 --> 00:12:58,800
they uh believe in this because they've

348
00:13:02,710 --> 00:13:00,560
never done any real research

349
00:13:03,750 --> 00:13:02,720
or if they have they've just read

350
00:13:06,389 --> 00:13:03,760
somebody else's

351
00:13:07,269 --> 00:13:06,399
uh work uh on the uh on the uh the

352
00:13:09,430 --> 00:13:07,279
subject and

353
00:13:11,190 --> 00:13:09,440
done very little research of their own

354
00:13:14,230 --> 00:13:11,200
now there is a negative effect

355
00:13:16,389 --> 00:13:14,240
to this uh i mean uh aspect of this uh

356
00:13:18,470 --> 00:13:16,399
we know that we've written books like uh

357
00:13:20,230 --> 00:13:18,480
a round trip to hell in a pair uh in a

358
00:13:21,030 --> 00:13:20,240
flying saucer one of my favorites

359
00:13:23,509 --> 00:13:21,040
actually

360
00:13:24,069 --> 00:13:23,519
and a couple of books on what we call

361
00:13:27,430 --> 00:13:24,079
the

362
00:13:29,350 --> 00:13:27,440
and

363
00:13:30,710 --> 00:13:29,360
quite a few other writers who approached

364
00:13:34,230 --> 00:13:30,720
this from a

365
00:13:38,150 --> 00:13:34,240
uh i would say a negative

366
00:13:38,629 --> 00:13:38,160
point of view now what what impressed

367
00:13:40,389 --> 00:13:38,639
you the

368
00:13:42,629 --> 00:13:40,399
the most i mean looking back at all

369
00:13:44,150 --> 00:13:42,639
these uh uh individuals that you spoke

370
00:13:45,269 --> 00:13:44,160
to in all the cases that you've

371
00:13:47,430 --> 00:13:45,279
investigated

372
00:13:49,110 --> 00:13:47,440
what what kind of put you over the the

373
00:13:51,829 --> 00:13:49,120
top as far as

374
00:13:54,550 --> 00:13:51,839
uh believing uh and accepting the

375
00:13:56,870 --> 00:13:54,560
phenomena is real

376
00:13:57,750 --> 00:13:56,880
uh well i mean i i think the only way

377
00:14:00,150 --> 00:13:57,760
anyone can

378
00:14:01,990 --> 00:14:00,160
accept that it's real for the most part

379
00:14:04,310 --> 00:14:02,000
is to have their own experiences with it

380
00:14:05,829 --> 00:14:04,320
i mean you they they used to buy a hot

381
00:14:07,350 --> 00:14:05,839
consent at one point

382
00:14:08,870 --> 00:14:07,360
you could present enough evidence about

383
00:14:11,110 --> 00:14:08,880
ufos and abduction that

384
00:14:12,150 --> 00:14:11,120
uh you would win a case in a court of

385
00:14:14,310 --> 00:14:12,160
law

386
00:14:19,030 --> 00:14:14,320
you nearly prove it but you can present

387
00:14:22,870 --> 00:14:21,110
so i think to really be a believer to

388
00:14:25,910 --> 00:14:22,880
really to really be a part of

389
00:14:27,750 --> 00:14:25,920
the experience you have had your own

390
00:14:31,030 --> 00:14:27,760
contact with it your own

391
00:14:32,710 --> 00:14:31,040
physical or psychological emotional

392
00:14:35,030 --> 00:14:32,720
excuse me contact with whatever these

393
00:14:38,230 --> 00:14:35,040
creatures are

394
00:14:41,670 --> 00:14:38,240
now would you say that the uh the

395
00:14:45,590 --> 00:14:41,680
aliens of today are the angels

396
00:14:46,150 --> 00:14:45,600
of scripture yes yes as well as i

397
00:14:49,590 --> 00:14:46,160
believe

398
00:14:51,110 --> 00:14:49,600
very strongly and and what uh what

399
00:14:53,509 --> 00:14:51,120
points you in that direction i mean what

400
00:14:55,829 --> 00:14:53,519
evidence do you see of that

401
00:14:58,470 --> 00:14:55,839
well you know this is this is a subject

402
00:15:00,470 --> 00:14:58,480
where you can really teach it either way

403
00:15:02,710 --> 00:15:00,480
you you one person can argue angelic

404
00:15:04,389 --> 00:15:02,720
another person can argue demonic

405
00:15:05,670 --> 00:15:04,399
and you could one guy can show his

406
00:15:07,189 --> 00:15:05,680
scriptures he didn't think i could show

407
00:15:10,150 --> 00:15:07,199
the other scriptures they could just

408
00:15:11,829 --> 00:15:10,160
go on forever you could teach it in a

409
00:15:14,310 --> 00:15:11,839
way and there's no way to easily resolve

410
00:15:17,590 --> 00:15:17,189
oh my god what yeah well now we have in

411
00:15:19,750 --> 00:15:17,600
this

412
00:15:21,509 --> 00:15:19,760
recent book the ufos are again in

413
00:15:25,350 --> 00:15:21,519
biblical revelations uh

414
00:15:28,150 --> 00:15:25,360
i i'm not a a man of faith

415
00:15:30,150 --> 00:15:28,160
to uh any degree i mean i consider

416
00:15:33,350 --> 00:15:30,160
myself a spiritual person but

417
00:15:36,150 --> 00:15:33,360
i don't know how much i believe

418
00:15:36,870 --> 00:15:36,160
uh or accept the word of your god or

419
00:15:40,150 --> 00:15:36,880
what's in the

420
00:15:42,710 --> 00:15:40,160
the bible but we do look uh in this book

421
00:15:43,590 --> 00:15:42,720
at uh what would we say here we're we're

422
00:15:45,430 --> 00:15:43,600
talking about

423
00:15:46,949 --> 00:15:45,440
the assessment of biblical miracles

424
00:15:49,350 --> 00:15:46,959
prophecies and modern

425
00:15:50,710 --> 00:15:49,360
uh anomalous phenomena including ufos

426
00:15:54,230 --> 00:15:50,720
and marian

427
00:15:56,870 --> 00:15:54,240
apparitions and we use uh

428
00:15:57,749 --> 00:15:56,880
photos to to prove this point i mean we

429
00:16:01,030 --> 00:15:57,759
have uh

430
00:16:04,389 --> 00:16:01,040
pictures in there of uh uh weeping uh

431
00:16:06,949 --> 00:16:04,399
angel statues we have uh a um

432
00:16:07,509 --> 00:16:06,959
considerable amount of space devoted to

433
00:16:10,150 --> 00:16:07,519
the

434
00:16:12,310 --> 00:16:10,160
marian uh phenomena which uh uh of

435
00:16:13,990 --> 00:16:12,320
course uh well we think it dates back to

436
00:16:15,749 --> 00:16:14,000
to fatima or most people would think it

437
00:16:18,310 --> 00:16:15,759
does but uh

438
00:16:18,949 --> 00:16:18,320
isn't there uh in the bible a a

439
00:16:23,030 --> 00:16:18,959
reference

440
00:16:25,670 --> 00:16:23,040
to uh to the uh to to marry having an

441
00:16:28,069 --> 00:16:25,680
impact on in the in the final the days

442
00:16:30,150 --> 00:16:28,079
of the revelations and so forth

443
00:16:32,310 --> 00:16:30,160
and i know they talk about a dragon a

444
00:16:34,310 --> 00:16:32,320
dragon and a lion or something

445
00:16:36,470 --> 00:16:34,320
they think about revelation chapter 12

446
00:16:38,389 --> 00:16:36,480
where the woman is giving birth

447
00:16:40,470 --> 00:16:38,399
mm-hmm and and the dragon is poised

448
00:16:42,629 --> 00:16:40,480
ready to eat the child

449
00:16:44,230 --> 00:16:42,639
yeah that's revelation chapter 12 verse

450
00:16:45,590 --> 00:16:44,240
first five specifically mentions the

451
00:16:47,110 --> 00:16:45,600
woman

452
00:16:48,470 --> 00:16:47,120
and and that has been you know again

453
00:16:49,350 --> 00:16:48,480
that's been interpreted many ways some

454
00:16:52,069 --> 00:16:49,360
people think it

455
00:16:53,269 --> 00:16:52,079
means that uh she's giving birth to a

456
00:16:54,790 --> 00:16:53,279
reincarnated christ

457
00:16:57,030 --> 00:16:54,800
christ is being born again into the

458
00:16:59,030 --> 00:16:57,040
world as a human being

459
00:17:00,470 --> 00:16:59,040
other people say it's the birth of a new

460
00:17:03,509 --> 00:17:00,480
church the birth of a new

461
00:17:06,470 --> 00:17:03,519
understanding it's it's

462
00:17:07,510 --> 00:17:06,480
you know the uh the words of revelation

463
00:17:10,630 --> 00:17:07,520
are symbolic

464
00:17:11,029 --> 00:17:10,640
you know you it's a good uh it's hard to

465
00:17:13,429 --> 00:17:11,039
pin

466
00:17:14,630 --> 00:17:13,439
down anything as as a simple literal

467
00:17:16,549 --> 00:17:14,640
truth

468
00:17:17,829 --> 00:17:16,559
it's it's it's more a matter of symbols

469
00:17:20,390 --> 00:17:17,839
and spiritual

470
00:17:22,949 --> 00:17:20,400
understanding as opposed to literal or

471
00:17:24,710 --> 00:17:22,959
concrete real-world understanding

472
00:17:26,870 --> 00:17:24,720
you just have to you have to go with the

473
00:17:29,830 --> 00:17:26,880
symbols the idea of symbolism and

474
00:17:31,669 --> 00:17:29,840
well you you you have a you have a book

475
00:17:34,150 --> 00:17:31,679
uh on

476
00:17:35,110 --> 00:17:34,160
symbols and signs of the second coming

477
00:17:37,350 --> 00:17:35,120
what

478
00:17:38,710 --> 00:17:37,360
are are we do you feel that we are in

479
00:17:41,110 --> 00:17:38,720
the end times

480
00:17:42,470 --> 00:17:41,120
oh definitely yeah i thought i thought

481
00:17:43,430 --> 00:17:42,480
the end times are gonna happen a lot

482
00:17:44,710 --> 00:17:43,440
sooner

483
00:17:46,070 --> 00:17:44,720
than they are but i think we're

484
00:17:47,750 --> 00:17:46,080
definitely yeah we're definitely inching

485
00:17:48,870 --> 00:17:47,760
toward it close more closely all the

486
00:17:51,430 --> 00:17:48,880
time

487
00:17:52,789 --> 00:17:51,440
and and and what will happen yeah what

488
00:17:54,710 --> 00:17:52,799
will happen in the uh

489
00:17:59,110 --> 00:17:54,720
in the end times i mean is the the world

490
00:18:00,630 --> 00:17:59,120
going to collide with an asteroid or um

491
00:18:02,950 --> 00:18:00,640
well there's no there's no real way to

492
00:18:03,510 --> 00:18:02,960
know that i mean i i i think i remember

493
00:18:06,230 --> 00:18:03,520
this

494
00:18:07,669 --> 00:18:06,240
not to try to predict the future not to

495
00:18:09,110 --> 00:18:07,679
trust my own interpretation of

496
00:18:10,390 --> 00:18:09,120
revelation or the other books of

497
00:18:12,390 --> 00:18:10,400
prophecy

498
00:18:14,070 --> 00:18:12,400
because it's just you know it's just

499
00:18:16,549 --> 00:18:14,080
over mortal

500
00:18:18,310 --> 00:18:16,559
conscious understanding it evolves it

501
00:18:20,549 --> 00:18:18,320
involves the nature of time it involves

502
00:18:23,029 --> 00:18:20,559
the nature of god's will

503
00:18:24,789 --> 00:18:23,039
it involves the nature of predestination

504
00:18:26,150 --> 00:18:24,799
the idea that mankind in some sense

505
00:18:30,870 --> 00:18:26,160
doesn't even have free will

506
00:18:33,669 --> 00:18:30,880
as part of it well don't do it

507
00:18:35,350 --> 00:18:33,679
do we have do we have free will well

508
00:18:36,870 --> 00:18:35,360
yeah you call this thing the matrix

509
00:18:38,870 --> 00:18:36,880
where where you think you're all into

510
00:18:40,950 --> 00:18:38,880
some kind of subliminal control

511
00:18:42,470 --> 00:18:40,960
something like that yes

512
00:18:44,070 --> 00:18:42,480
and that the things like synchronicity

513
00:18:47,830 --> 00:18:44,080
are really hints you know

514
00:18:49,830 --> 00:18:47,840
sort of a a joking acknowledgement that

515
00:18:51,430 --> 00:18:49,840
we are under that kind of outside

516
00:18:53,510 --> 00:18:51,440
control

517
00:18:54,870 --> 00:18:53,520
and and a lot of that you know a lot of

518
00:18:56,710 --> 00:18:54,880
that is possible i mean

519
00:18:58,230 --> 00:18:56,720
what is what has created the matrix what

520
00:19:01,830 --> 00:18:58,240
has created

521
00:19:05,750 --> 00:19:03,830
it's not something mechanical it's

522
00:19:09,669 --> 00:19:05,760
something like you know god almighty

523
00:19:11,430 --> 00:19:09,679
that um it's not just some kind of

524
00:19:13,190 --> 00:19:11,440
science fiction enemy we can prevail

525
00:19:16,390 --> 00:19:13,200
against

526
00:19:18,870 --> 00:19:16,400
something high high over our heads

527
00:19:19,510 --> 00:19:18,880
now some people have talked about a uh

528
00:19:22,950 --> 00:19:19,520
like a

529
00:19:23,909 --> 00:19:22,960
a mass a ufo landing and people being

530
00:19:26,230 --> 00:19:23,919
taken up

531
00:19:27,270 --> 00:19:26,240
during the the rapture i mean do you

532
00:19:30,390 --> 00:19:27,280
take it uh

533
00:19:32,390 --> 00:19:30,400
uh uh literally that uh

534
00:19:34,310 --> 00:19:32,400
christ will return to the planet and

535
00:19:36,470 --> 00:19:34,320
take the chosen

536
00:19:39,029 --> 00:19:36,480
well you know we we uh talk about that

537
00:19:41,110 --> 00:19:39,039
uh in terms of the space for this also

538
00:19:42,710 --> 00:19:41,120
yes space brothers tend to make that

539
00:19:44,470 --> 00:19:42,720
same promise

540
00:19:45,750 --> 00:19:44,480
and to me has an excellent correlation

541
00:19:48,549 --> 00:19:45,760
between uh uh

542
00:19:50,070 --> 00:19:48,559
old-fashioned christianity and and new

543
00:19:52,310 --> 00:19:50,080
age belief in aliens

544
00:19:55,590 --> 00:19:52,320
you have that same basic concept

545
00:19:58,630 --> 00:19:57,590
both as a christian thing and as a new

546
00:20:00,950 --> 00:19:58,640
age

547
00:20:01,990 --> 00:20:00,960
who exactly who exactly are the were

548
00:20:03,510 --> 00:20:02,000
they

549
00:20:05,990 --> 00:20:03,520
see who could who could possibly know

550
00:20:09,190 --> 00:20:06,000
that yeah

551
00:20:10,870 --> 00:20:09,200
why i you that's why i'm asking

552
00:20:12,549 --> 00:20:10,880
no no i i don't i don't know the

553
00:20:15,190 --> 00:20:12,559
standards by which people are chosen

554
00:20:15,990 --> 00:20:15,200
i hope i haven't chosen one myself

555
00:20:19,110 --> 00:20:16,000
uh-huh

556
00:20:21,669 --> 00:20:19,120
well i it depends on where they uh

557
00:20:22,549 --> 00:20:21,679
now oh okay suppose there is a rapture

558
00:20:26,950 --> 00:20:22,559
or a

559
00:20:28,470 --> 00:20:26,960
a mass ufo landing where do we go

560
00:20:29,990 --> 00:20:28,480
see that's another thing they don't they

561
00:20:32,310 --> 00:20:30,000
don't really tell you

562
00:20:33,990 --> 00:20:32,320
yeah some people think of some kind of

563
00:20:36,950 --> 00:20:34,000
uh heavenly dimension

564
00:20:37,830 --> 00:20:36,960
yes some unknown place where they keep

565
00:20:40,390 --> 00:20:37,840
us for a while

566
00:20:41,029 --> 00:20:40,400
safe yeah don't we talk about that in

567
00:20:42,789 --> 00:20:41,039
the book

568
00:20:44,390 --> 00:20:42,799
i remember we used some uh uh

569
00:20:46,789 --> 00:20:44,400
photographs of

570
00:20:48,310 --> 00:20:46,799
a place that has uh seven dimensions or

571
00:20:50,710 --> 00:20:48,320
seven levels

572
00:20:51,669 --> 00:20:50,720
ah yeah well there's you know i've seen

573
00:20:53,830 --> 00:20:51,679
another theory

574
00:20:54,710 --> 00:20:53,840
where uh it's based i think on

575
00:20:57,510 --> 00:20:54,720
interpretation

576
00:20:58,710 --> 00:20:57,520
of a verse in the book of psalms i'm not

577
00:21:00,789 --> 00:20:58,720
totally sure

578
00:21:03,430 --> 00:21:00,799
but it's a place on earth hidden under

579
00:21:07,190 --> 00:21:03,440
uh some kind of a

580
00:21:09,029 --> 00:21:07,200
rock structure that resembles wings

581
00:21:10,549 --> 00:21:09,039
the idea you know is to keep us hidden

582
00:21:13,350 --> 00:21:10,559
and safe it's not that

583
00:21:15,590 --> 00:21:13,360
not necessarily since it takes cover

584
00:21:19,029 --> 00:21:15,600
some kind of spiritual ecstasy

585
00:21:22,230 --> 00:21:19,039
the point is that we live on past the uh

586
00:21:26,070 --> 00:21:22,240
the time of uh the tribulation

587
00:21:29,270 --> 00:21:26,080
yes oh okay so that could possibly be

588
00:21:31,830 --> 00:21:29,280
in the hollow earth if there were

589
00:21:32,310 --> 00:21:31,840
yeah right right right okay well that

590
00:21:34,549 --> 00:21:32,320
that

591
00:21:36,950 --> 00:21:34,559
i mean we certainly uh uh written on

592
00:21:38,549 --> 00:21:36,960
that subject probably more than uh

593
00:21:39,990 --> 00:21:38,559
any other uh publisher i don't know we

594
00:21:42,870 --> 00:21:40,000
have probably 15

595
00:21:44,710 --> 00:21:42,880
books out there including one by

596
00:21:46,630 --> 00:21:44,720
reverend william blessing

597
00:21:47,830 --> 00:21:46,640
who's been deceived for many many many

598
00:21:50,630 --> 00:21:47,840
many years but

599
00:21:52,710 --> 00:21:50,640
he actually kind of uh he talks about

600
00:21:54,870 --> 00:21:52,720
the hollow earth in biblical sense and

601
00:21:55,990 --> 00:21:54,880
are the space people you know friends or

602
00:21:58,950 --> 00:21:56,000
are foe

603
00:22:00,549 --> 00:21:58,960
and uh even that talks about a uh a

604
00:22:03,590 --> 00:22:00,559
supposed canopy

605
00:22:06,870 --> 00:22:03,600
that at one time existed over the earth

606
00:22:10,149 --> 00:22:06,880
which blocked out the harmful uh

607
00:22:10,630 --> 00:22:10,159
radioactive rays of the sun and before

608
00:22:14,630 --> 00:22:10,640
this

609
00:22:17,669 --> 00:22:14,640
canopy was uh destroyed perhaps also

610
00:22:19,590 --> 00:22:17,679
uh in some sort of uh

611
00:22:21,750 --> 00:22:19,600
hit by a comet or an asteroid that maybe

612
00:22:25,029 --> 00:22:21,760
did away with the the dinosaurs as

613
00:22:27,510 --> 00:22:25,039
well that's just a conjecture

614
00:22:28,390 --> 00:22:27,520
people lived a lot longer than they do

615
00:22:32,070 --> 00:22:28,400
today

616
00:22:34,549 --> 00:22:32,080
am i correct in that yes right right

617
00:22:36,070 --> 00:22:34,559
you know but to me it's all about the

618
00:22:36,870 --> 00:22:36,080
idea that there's so much that we don't

619
00:22:41,830 --> 00:22:36,880
know

620
00:22:43,430 --> 00:22:41,840
own species

621
00:22:45,350 --> 00:22:43,440
i mean we're just like these these kind

622
00:22:46,470 --> 00:22:45,360
of mindless babies wandering around in

623
00:22:48,149 --> 00:22:46,480
the dark

624
00:22:50,070 --> 00:22:48,159
we don't really know anything at all at

625
00:22:53,350 --> 00:22:50,080
this point because we

626
00:22:54,870 --> 00:22:53,360
we're so far down on the chain of

627
00:22:56,390 --> 00:22:54,880
of intelligence and we have to wait to

628
00:22:59,830 --> 00:22:56,400
be told this stuff

629
00:23:01,270 --> 00:22:59,840
well there are higher intelligences i i

630
00:23:03,990 --> 00:23:01,280
guess would you consider the

631
00:23:05,590 --> 00:23:04,000
uh angels to be of higher intelligence

632
00:23:08,470 --> 00:23:05,600
yeah it says that in the bible the eyes

633
00:23:09,909 --> 00:23:08,480
made man a little lower than the angels

634
00:23:12,630 --> 00:23:09,919
the angels are our moral and

635
00:23:14,710 --> 00:23:12,640
intellectual superiors

636
00:23:16,630 --> 00:23:14,720
and that means that means you have to be

637
00:23:20,230 --> 00:23:16,640
able to accept a certain amount of

638
00:23:22,470 --> 00:23:20,240
mortal inferiority you have to humble

639
00:23:24,710 --> 00:23:22,480
yourself to that extent

640
00:23:27,029 --> 00:23:24,720
you have that to be willing to accept

641
00:23:28,630 --> 00:23:27,039
that you're simply a humble mortal

642
00:23:31,110 --> 00:23:28,640
all right tim we need to we need to

643
00:23:32,549 --> 00:23:31,120
humble ourselves for our upcoming break

644
00:23:34,870 --> 00:23:32,559
and when we come back

645
00:23:37,430 --> 00:23:34,880
we'll continue our conversation with

646
00:23:47,590 --> 00:23:37,440
john castillo on exploring the bazaar

647
00:23:52,870 --> 00:23:50,710
now back to exploring the bazaar

648
00:23:54,870 --> 00:23:52,880
with two of the most electrifying

649
00:23:58,149 --> 00:23:54,880
researchers in the paranormal

650
00:24:02,470 --> 00:23:58,159
your hosts timothy beckley and tim

651
00:24:06,310 --> 00:24:04,310
welcome back to exploring the bazaar i'm

652
00:24:09,909 --> 00:24:06,320
tim schwartz tonight our guest

653
00:24:13,350 --> 00:24:09,919
is sean castille sean is the author

654
00:24:14,470 --> 00:24:13,360
of the book ufos armageddon and biblical

655
00:24:17,990 --> 00:24:14,480
revelations sign

656
00:24:20,390 --> 00:24:18,000
symbols and wonders the whole truth

657
00:24:21,350 --> 00:24:20,400
now sean we have a question from one of

658
00:24:25,029 --> 00:24:21,360
our listeners

659
00:24:26,310 --> 00:24:25,039
uh uh pick and duck and pick and duck

660
00:24:30,230 --> 00:24:26,320
wants to know

661
00:24:31,669 --> 00:24:30,240
do you think that uh uh

662
00:24:34,310 --> 00:24:31,679
what is written in the bible the old

663
00:24:36,029 --> 00:24:34,320
testament about jonah and the whale and

664
00:24:40,149 --> 00:24:36,039
then he put in parentheses

665
00:24:43,350 --> 00:24:41,830
no that's pretty interesting right

666
00:24:46,470 --> 00:24:43,360
that's a good question isn't it

667
00:24:50,470 --> 00:24:46,480
yeah and by the way i have to say

668
00:24:54,230 --> 00:24:50,480
he has um this particular head listener

669
00:24:56,390 --> 00:24:54,240
has commented and uh uh on just about

670
00:24:57,830 --> 00:24:56,400
all of our shows i i see every day he's

671
00:24:59,590 --> 00:24:57,840
posting in youtube some

672
00:25:01,430 --> 00:24:59,600
questions or comments so hello there

673
00:25:02,549 --> 00:25:01,440
finally go ahead sean i didn't mean to

674
00:25:03,909 --> 00:25:02,559
interrupt you yeah

675
00:25:05,990 --> 00:25:03,919
well of course we're talking with jonah

676
00:25:07,110 --> 00:25:06,000
was in the belly of the whale for three

677
00:25:09,269 --> 00:25:07,120
days

678
00:25:10,870 --> 00:25:09,279
and christ said uh to the to the hostile

679
00:25:13,190 --> 00:25:10,880
crowds the only the only sign you're

680
00:25:14,870 --> 00:25:13,200
gonna get is the sign of jonah

681
00:25:17,029 --> 00:25:14,880
which christ is using to say that he

682
00:25:18,950 --> 00:25:17,039
would be three days in the ground and

683
00:25:21,269 --> 00:25:18,960
would rise again

684
00:25:24,070 --> 00:25:21,279
so i mean obviously uh jonah is a is a

685
00:25:25,269 --> 00:25:24,080
heavy metaphor in in a lot of ways

686
00:25:27,430 --> 00:25:25,279
but the idea that the whale could have

687
00:25:30,149 --> 00:25:27,440
been a uso is certainly an

688
00:25:31,830 --> 00:25:30,159
interesting idea it's one i've never

689
00:25:33,669 --> 00:25:31,840
really thought of before

690
00:25:35,269 --> 00:25:33,679
but it's an interesting one you know

691
00:25:36,870 --> 00:25:35,279
what's most interesting to me about the

692
00:25:39,669 --> 00:25:36,880
book of jonah

693
00:25:41,750 --> 00:25:39,679
is is uh the lord sends jonah to deliver

694
00:25:45,110 --> 00:25:41,760
a message of doom

695
00:25:47,190 --> 00:25:45,120
to uh to nineveh to babylon

696
00:25:48,390 --> 00:25:47,200
and of course uh jonah is unwilling to

697
00:25:49,909 --> 00:25:48,400
go

698
00:25:51,669 --> 00:25:49,919
he tries to escape from the mission the

699
00:25:53,110 --> 00:25:51,679
facility ends up

700
00:25:54,870 --> 00:25:53,120
through a lot of circumstances in the

701
00:25:57,029 --> 00:25:54,880
belly of the whale

702
00:25:59,750 --> 00:25:57,039
but anyway god says at the end of the

703
00:26:02,070 --> 00:25:59,760
book he's going to repent of the evil

704
00:26:03,830 --> 00:26:02,080
that he had spoken against nineveh which

705
00:26:06,789 --> 00:26:03,840
said god himself was going to repent of

706
00:26:09,430 --> 00:26:06,799
what he had said and change his mind

707
00:26:09,990 --> 00:26:09,440
now the idea that you have you have a

708
00:26:11,909 --> 00:26:10,000
that kind of

709
00:26:13,350 --> 00:26:11,919
a changeability in god i think is a

710
00:26:15,909 --> 00:26:13,360
fascinating idea

711
00:26:18,310 --> 00:26:15,919
that he could rethink his own his own uh

712
00:26:19,909 --> 00:26:18,320
concepts as his own actions

713
00:26:22,310 --> 00:26:19,919
he can't like a person would you simply

714
00:26:25,669 --> 00:26:22,320
change his mind and decide to take pity

715
00:26:28,789 --> 00:26:25,679
on somebody he had formally judged

716
00:26:31,110 --> 00:26:28,799
so it did it's a sort of uh

717
00:26:31,909 --> 00:26:31,120
a very interesting humanizing approach

718
00:26:33,990 --> 00:26:31,919
to

719
00:26:35,350 --> 00:26:34,000
god almighty you're not dealing with

720
00:26:38,549 --> 00:26:35,360
some kind of inflexible

721
00:26:40,789 --> 00:26:38,559
uh a creature who who's demanding an

722
00:26:42,230 --> 00:26:40,799
impossible perfection

723
00:26:44,950 --> 00:26:42,240
he can change his mind and go with the

724
00:26:47,590 --> 00:26:44,960
flow a little bit

725
00:26:48,070 --> 00:26:47,600
now uh pig and duck also asked the

726
00:26:50,230 --> 00:26:48,080
question

727
00:26:51,110 --> 00:26:50,240
and you know like good good luck with

728
00:26:54,470 --> 00:26:51,120
this one

729
00:26:55,190 --> 00:26:54,480
uh but uh wants to know uh do we know

730
00:26:58,070 --> 00:26:55,200
where we are

731
00:26:58,789 --> 00:26:58,080
on the timeline given in the bible which

732
00:27:00,549 --> 00:26:58,799
yeah yeah

733
00:27:02,070 --> 00:27:00,559
if you i imagine if you could answer

734
00:27:03,029 --> 00:27:02,080
that question you wouldn't be on our

735
00:27:04,789 --> 00:27:03,039
show

736
00:27:06,070 --> 00:27:04,799
exactly i don't think it's possible for

737
00:27:08,789 --> 00:27:06,080
a human being even

738
00:27:10,470 --> 00:27:08,799
a christian intellectual human being to

739
00:27:12,470 --> 00:27:10,480
answer that question

740
00:27:13,990 --> 00:27:12,480
like i was saying earlier the book of

741
00:27:17,909 --> 00:27:14,000
revelation is written in

742
00:27:21,269 --> 00:27:17,919
heavy heavily uh obscured of symbolism

743
00:27:23,430 --> 00:27:21,279
and uh to try to make a chronological

744
00:27:24,549 --> 00:27:23,440
story out of all those prophecies

745
00:27:29,590 --> 00:27:24,559
contained there

746
00:27:32,870 --> 00:27:31,750
better men than me have tried and it

747
00:27:35,190 --> 00:27:32,880
just can't be done

748
00:27:36,710 --> 00:27:35,200
well i mean considering uh all the books

749
00:27:39,029 --> 00:27:36,720
that have been written

750
00:27:40,470 --> 00:27:39,039
that uh have have tried to make a you

751
00:27:43,669 --> 00:27:40,480
know an earnest

752
00:27:45,830 --> 00:27:43,679
attempt to uh predict

753
00:27:47,590 --> 00:27:45,840
you know like the the end times and

754
00:27:49,669 --> 00:27:47,600
stuff like that based on their own you

755
00:27:51,190 --> 00:27:49,679
know computations on uh

756
00:27:53,029 --> 00:27:51,200
you know based on the bible the book of

757
00:27:56,789 --> 00:27:53,039
revelations i mean

758
00:27:59,190 --> 00:27:56,799
uh hundreds maybe thousands of

759
00:28:00,630 --> 00:27:59,200
books and uh you know so far we're still

760
00:28:05,590 --> 00:28:00,640
here

761
00:28:07,350 --> 00:28:05,600
continual effort

762
00:28:09,190 --> 00:28:07,360
to say i'm the guy who finally figured

763
00:28:11,029 --> 00:28:09,200
out the book of revelation

764
00:28:12,710 --> 00:28:11,039
and i just think that you know sometimes

765
00:28:13,269 --> 00:28:12,720
they lose all sorts of tragedies that

766
00:28:15,909 --> 00:28:13,279
result

767
00:28:17,510 --> 00:28:15,919
all sorts of misunderstandings the

768
00:28:19,190 --> 00:28:17,520
smartest thing you can do you can say i

769
00:28:21,909 --> 00:28:19,200
believe in the book of revelation i have

770
00:28:23,750 --> 00:28:21,919
no idea how all that's going to unfold

771
00:28:26,870 --> 00:28:23,760
i have no idea what what the timeline

772
00:28:29,430 --> 00:28:26,880
what the storyline is going to be

773
00:28:30,070 --> 00:28:29,440
well i guess uh also you have to correct

774
00:28:32,470 --> 00:28:30,080
me on this

775
00:28:34,310 --> 00:28:32,480
uh sean because you know you know about

776
00:28:35,029 --> 00:28:34,320
this stuff a lot better than i do that

777
00:28:41,510 --> 00:28:35,039
uh

778
00:28:45,110 --> 00:28:41,520
for a while um

779
00:28:48,950 --> 00:28:45,120
wasn't even considered to be

780
00:28:49,510 --> 00:28:48,960
um to be picked out to be the last book

781
00:28:51,909 --> 00:28:49,520
of the uh

782
00:28:52,789 --> 00:28:51,919
the last uh part of the bible i can't

783
00:28:56,789 --> 00:28:52,799
remember

784
00:28:58,070 --> 00:28:56,799
supposed to be but then somewhere along

785
00:29:00,310 --> 00:28:58,080
the lines line someone said hey

786
00:29:01,430 --> 00:29:00,320
look at this let's put this in here

787
00:29:03,430 --> 00:29:01,440
right yeah

788
00:29:04,789 --> 00:29:03,440
it had it sells detractors from the very

789
00:29:07,990 --> 00:29:04,799
beginning

790
00:29:09,909 --> 00:29:08,000
uh some people uh have even said that if

791
00:29:11,750 --> 00:29:09,919
the prophet john who wrote the book was

792
00:29:13,590 --> 00:29:11,760
was simply hallucinating

793
00:29:15,909 --> 00:29:13,600
he was simply having a bad acid trip or

794
00:29:18,789 --> 00:29:15,919
something and that kind of sarcasm just

795
00:29:20,389 --> 00:29:18,799
gets directed at it all the time

796
00:29:22,070 --> 00:29:20,399
and uh and yeah like you see i mean

797
00:29:22,870 --> 00:29:22,080
there's there's there's a whole lot

798
00:29:24,630 --> 00:29:22,880
market out there

799
00:29:26,149 --> 00:29:24,640
different belief systems about the about

800
00:29:27,750 --> 00:29:26,159
the book of revelation

801
00:29:29,269 --> 00:29:27,760
there's another interview i did for 10

802
00:29:32,630 --> 00:29:29,279
years and years ago with uh

803
00:29:36,310 --> 00:29:32,640
the late great robert anton wilson

804
00:29:39,430 --> 00:29:36,320
and he said uh the words ds

805
00:29:41,909 --> 00:29:39,440
really stand for belief system you

806
00:29:44,180 --> 00:29:41,919
should never believe anybody else's bs

807
00:29:46,549 --> 00:29:44,190
and especially never believe your own bs

808
00:29:49,350 --> 00:29:46,559
[Laughter]

809
00:29:49,750 --> 00:29:49,360
which is really true it is you just you

810
00:29:53,350 --> 00:29:49,760
just

811
00:29:54,389 --> 00:29:53,360
dark hoping to see a little light at

812
00:29:56,310 --> 00:29:54,399
some point

813
00:29:57,990 --> 00:29:56,320
it's all over our heads it involves an

814
00:29:58,870 --> 00:29:58,000
understanding of time that we probably

815
00:30:01,990 --> 00:29:58,880
can't contain

816
00:30:05,350 --> 00:30:02,000
in mortal consciousness at all

817
00:30:08,549 --> 00:30:05,360
i i do i do think that uh

818
00:30:09,750 --> 00:30:08,559
beautiful interpretation of god

819
00:30:12,870 --> 00:30:09,760
does free you from a lot of

820
00:30:14,389 --> 00:30:12,880
fundamentalist blindness

821
00:30:16,149 --> 00:30:14,399
i i think the fundamentalists set an

822
00:30:18,630 --> 00:30:16,159
impossible standard for themselves and

823
00:30:20,549 --> 00:30:18,640
for other people

824
00:30:22,070 --> 00:30:20,559
it really isn't all that necessary i i

825
00:30:25,830 --> 00:30:22,080
think once once you

826
00:30:26,870 --> 00:30:25,840
once you tap into uh some aspect of the

827
00:30:29,269 --> 00:30:26,880
ufo

828
00:30:30,310 --> 00:30:29,279
uh version of god you're basically

829
00:30:31,669 --> 00:30:30,320
dealing with something friendly

830
00:30:33,029 --> 00:30:31,679
something reaching out to you in

831
00:30:34,310 --> 00:30:33,039
kindness

832
00:30:37,029 --> 00:30:34,320
he's not somebody just you know just

833
00:30:38,230 --> 00:30:37,039
itching at the that uh

834
00:30:41,190 --> 00:30:38,240
itching to throw you into the lake of

835
00:30:43,110 --> 00:30:41,200
fire you know because you

836
00:30:45,990 --> 00:30:43,120
you felt some impossible standard of

837
00:30:50,549 --> 00:30:46,000
fundamentalism

838
00:30:53,590 --> 00:30:50,559
now um one of the parts of of your book

839
00:30:55,510 --> 00:30:53,600
that uh that i i find fascinating and

840
00:30:58,149 --> 00:30:55,520
and this is something that that i've

841
00:31:01,430 --> 00:30:58,159
researched for for a long long time

842
00:31:05,590 --> 00:31:01,440
it's it's the whole um uh uh

843
00:31:07,590 --> 00:31:05,600
blessed virgin mary um apparitions

844
00:31:09,029 --> 00:31:07,600
uh you know we're talking about you know

845
00:31:11,590 --> 00:31:09,039
uh of

846
00:31:12,230 --> 00:31:11,600
fatima lords and and even you know some

847
00:31:15,430 --> 00:31:12,240
of the more

848
00:31:19,070 --> 00:31:15,440
uh recent cases

849
00:31:22,230 --> 00:31:19,080
but uh a lot of these um

850
00:31:23,830 --> 00:31:22,240
appearances uh and and i'm thinking

851
00:31:24,789 --> 00:31:23,840
especially along the lines of the ones

852
00:31:28,070 --> 00:31:24,799
that have taken place

853
00:31:31,909 --> 00:31:28,080
in egypt are are so

854
00:31:36,710 --> 00:31:31,919
similar to ufo sightings uh

855
00:31:40,710 --> 00:31:39,190
it just it just amazes me that there

856
00:31:41,509 --> 00:31:40,720
have been very few people present

857
00:31:44,789 --> 00:31:41,519
companies

858
00:31:48,549 --> 00:31:44,799
you know excluded that have

859
00:31:51,430 --> 00:31:48,559
attempted to look into this

860
00:31:53,269 --> 00:31:51,440
and and kind of uh you know cross uh uh

861
00:31:56,149 --> 00:31:53,279
across streams so to speak

862
00:31:57,830 --> 00:31:56,159
well jacques valet uh has uh mentioned

863
00:32:00,870 --> 00:31:57,840
this uh of course in

864
00:32:03,750 --> 00:32:00,880
in some of his uh writings about the uh

865
00:32:04,070 --> 00:32:03,760
whirling sun the sun supposedly coming

866
00:32:07,750 --> 00:32:04,080
uh

867
00:32:10,549 --> 00:32:07,760
all the people that

868
00:32:11,909 --> 00:32:10,559
were there and we're witnessing this uh

869
00:32:15,509 --> 00:32:11,919
phenomena i mean it

870
00:32:19,190 --> 00:32:15,519
it it seems that uh with the marian

871
00:32:23,430 --> 00:32:21,909
a trait like ted phillips did the you

872
00:32:25,990 --> 00:32:23,440
know the tracer

873
00:32:26,549 --> 00:32:26,000
400 trace cases well this is where you

874
00:32:28,750 --> 00:32:26,559
have

875
00:32:30,310 --> 00:32:28,760
your physical evidence that something is

876
00:32:33,509 --> 00:32:30,320
is

877
00:32:36,950 --> 00:32:33,519
going on i mean it's just uh

878
00:32:39,909 --> 00:32:36,960
a pile of evidence i mean that now

879
00:32:40,710 --> 00:32:39,919
it's up to interpretation exactly uh

880
00:32:44,230 --> 00:32:40,720
whether this

881
00:32:47,669 --> 00:32:44,240
is uh jesus's mother or

882
00:32:50,470 --> 00:32:47,679
uh the um lady i call her the lady in

883
00:32:52,470 --> 00:32:50,480
in white we even have a a case that's

884
00:32:55,750 --> 00:32:52,480
reported on in the book that took place

885
00:32:57,029 --> 00:32:55,760
in uh south america where the uh the

886
00:33:00,070 --> 00:32:57,039
lady in white

887
00:33:02,789 --> 00:33:00,080
was living in a cave and people went and

888
00:33:04,470 --> 00:33:02,799
communicated with her and i remember

889
00:33:05,830 --> 00:33:04,480
years ago and this is in the book i did

890
00:33:08,950 --> 00:33:05,840
an interview with

891
00:33:11,029 --> 00:33:08,960
the musician uh billy squire

892
00:33:12,070 --> 00:33:11,039
and he talked about how when he was a

893
00:33:15,110 --> 00:33:12,080
teenager

894
00:33:18,070 --> 00:33:15,120
he saw a globe come down out of the sky

895
00:33:18,549 --> 00:33:18,080
and there was a lady in white inside of

896
00:33:21,590 --> 00:33:18,559
this

897
00:33:22,710 --> 00:33:21,600
globe and there are i don't know dozens

898
00:33:27,110 --> 00:33:22,720
and dozens of

899
00:33:29,509 --> 00:33:27,120
photographs of the sumerian phenomena

900
00:33:30,710 --> 00:33:29,519
and just like the ufos are showing you

901
00:33:32,470 --> 00:33:30,720
have some of these cases

902
00:33:33,990 --> 00:33:32,480
where the people are actually seen to be

903
00:33:37,590 --> 00:33:34,000
in a translight

904
00:33:40,630 --> 00:33:38,710
well euphoria remember when we were

905
00:33:43,190 --> 00:33:40,640
working on what was your idea to include

906
00:33:45,190 --> 00:33:43,200
all the uh married google stuff

907
00:33:46,230 --> 00:33:45,200
and and looking back i realized that was

908
00:33:49,190 --> 00:33:46,240
a really intelligent

909
00:33:50,389 --> 00:33:49,200
decision there you know what the what

910
00:33:53,110 --> 00:33:50,399
the virgin mary means

911
00:33:55,350 --> 00:33:53,120
a lot of people is that there is a

912
00:33:56,310 --> 00:33:55,360
female aspect to god it's not just you

913
00:33:59,830 --> 00:33:56,320
know the angry

914
00:34:02,950 --> 00:33:59,840
patriarch in the sky there's also a

915
00:34:05,750 --> 00:34:02,960
tender uh nurturing female aspect to god

916
00:34:05,990 --> 00:34:05,760
that appears to people and again rooting

917
00:34:07,909 --> 00:34:06,000
out

918
00:34:14,069 --> 00:34:07,919
in kindness to try to work us through

919
00:34:17,909 --> 00:34:16,310
oh yeah definitely definitely because i

920
00:34:19,990 --> 00:34:17,919
mean it's like you said

921
00:34:21,270 --> 00:34:20,000
you know christianity especially has

922
00:34:23,990 --> 00:34:21,280
been you know very

923
00:34:26,149 --> 00:34:24,000
you know patriarchal uh through through

924
00:34:30,149 --> 00:34:26,159
most of its time with the exception

925
00:34:33,589 --> 00:34:30,159
of uh of of of mary

926
00:34:34,950 --> 00:34:33,599
and uh her what i've always found

927
00:34:36,869 --> 00:34:34,960
interesting myself

928
00:34:38,470 --> 00:34:36,879
and i'm sure you know tim tim will agree

929
00:34:41,829 --> 00:34:38,480
with this is

930
00:34:43,190 --> 00:34:41,839
that um sightings of her and again you

931
00:34:46,550 --> 00:34:43,200
know i'm going to go back to

932
00:34:48,230 --> 00:34:46,560
uh uh uh the ones in in egypt where

933
00:34:51,669 --> 00:34:48,240
there are actual you know photographs

934
00:34:54,790 --> 00:34:51,679
and videos taken of her appearances

935
00:34:57,990 --> 00:34:54,800
uh she

936
00:35:01,589 --> 00:34:58,000
she has this traditional look that

937
00:35:05,670 --> 00:35:01,599
has been um used

938
00:35:08,630 --> 00:35:05,680
in since medieval times of a you know

939
00:35:09,510 --> 00:35:08,640
uh almost a caucasian looking lady

940
00:35:12,790 --> 00:35:09,520
wearing

941
00:35:13,750 --> 00:35:12,800
uh a robe and a you know a headdress and

942
00:35:16,950 --> 00:35:13,760
everything like this

943
00:35:20,310 --> 00:35:16,960
something that probably the

944
00:35:21,750 --> 00:35:20,320
actual mother of of jesus

945
00:35:24,150 --> 00:35:21,760
she wouldn't have looked like this but

946
00:35:27,990 --> 00:35:24,160
we have this you know i guess almost

947
00:35:33,430 --> 00:35:28,000
a collective unconsciousness

948
00:35:37,190 --> 00:35:34,390
well i mean they're probably they're

949
00:35:39,829 --> 00:35:37,200
probably basing that uh that that was

950
00:35:41,670 --> 00:35:39,839
on uh the typical dress of jewish women

951
00:35:43,829 --> 00:35:41,680
at the time

952
00:35:45,430 --> 00:35:43,839
just like like with images of christ

953
00:35:47,510 --> 00:35:45,440
we've been crying from the painting

954
00:35:48,950 --> 00:35:47,520
that was our young man looked at the

955
00:35:50,310 --> 00:35:48,960
time with the long hair and the beard

956
00:35:52,069 --> 00:35:50,320
and everything

957
00:35:53,589 --> 00:35:52,079
it looked like that the conventions were

958
00:35:56,790 --> 00:35:53,599
fastened for that period

959
00:36:00,069 --> 00:35:56,800
right but uh what well

960
00:36:03,190 --> 00:36:00,079
you know what we did in in the book uh

961
00:36:05,670 --> 00:36:03,200
one of our contributors was uh also uh

962
00:36:06,630 --> 00:36:05,680
one of our graphic designers uh william

963
00:36:09,430 --> 00:36:06,640
kern

964
00:36:10,550 --> 00:36:09,440
and and i think he made some amazing

965
00:36:13,910 --> 00:36:10,560
discoveries

966
00:36:17,430 --> 00:36:13,920
relating the visions of the virgin mary

967
00:36:20,310 --> 00:36:17,440
to the muslim islamic faith

968
00:36:20,710 --> 00:36:20,320
as well in fact it turns out that the

969
00:36:23,910 --> 00:36:20,720
town

970
00:36:27,030 --> 00:36:23,920
fatima was named after a a

971
00:36:29,349 --> 00:36:27,040
a islamic lady

972
00:36:30,950 --> 00:36:29,359
i mean so that's part of their heritage

973
00:36:33,349 --> 00:36:30,960
as uh as well he

974
00:36:35,829 --> 00:36:33,359
he did a lot of good research uh on that

975
00:36:39,910 --> 00:36:35,839
so this concept of uh

976
00:36:40,550 --> 00:36:39,920
of a uh a lady in white or a virgin mary

977
00:36:43,430 --> 00:36:40,560
or the

978
00:36:44,470 --> 00:36:43,440
madonna uh seems to be it it is

979
00:36:46,470 --> 00:36:44,480
worldwide

980
00:36:48,310 --> 00:36:46,480
in fact if you go if you go back to the

981
00:36:52,390 --> 00:36:48,320
um uh

982
00:36:55,750 --> 00:36:52,400
the visions at fatima in 1917

983
00:36:56,310 --> 00:36:55,760
it was it took place in portugal of

984
00:36:59,349 --> 00:36:56,320
course

985
00:37:00,710 --> 00:36:59,359
uh it was a uh atheistic country i mean

986
00:37:03,270 --> 00:37:00,720
uh it was uh

987
00:37:04,390 --> 00:37:03,280
ruled by the uh the communists that the

988
00:37:06,390 --> 00:37:04,400
at the time and

989
00:37:07,670 --> 00:37:06,400
uh in fact they i think didn't they

990
00:37:10,630 --> 00:37:07,680
threaten that too

991
00:37:11,510 --> 00:37:10,640
uh sean to throw the the three children

992
00:37:16,150 --> 00:37:11,520
uh into

993
00:37:17,750 --> 00:37:16,160
jail yes he may have yeah

994
00:37:20,150 --> 00:37:17,760
might have been kind of revolutionary to

995
00:37:22,230 --> 00:37:20,160
talk about the virgin mary

996
00:37:23,589 --> 00:37:22,240
yeah okay yeah you're kind of uh uh

997
00:37:26,310 --> 00:37:23,599
breaking up a little bit there uh

998
00:37:27,030 --> 00:37:26,320
sean you may um yeah that it did get a

999
00:37:31,270 --> 00:37:27,040
little

1000
00:37:33,670 --> 00:37:31,280
uh rustic that's not the word

1001
00:37:34,630 --> 00:37:33,680
can you hear me now yeah yeah it's much

1002
00:37:38,069 --> 00:37:34,640
better much better

1003
00:37:38,470 --> 00:37:38,079
okay tim continue well um you know i'm

1004
00:37:44,230 --> 00:37:38,480
i'm

1005
00:37:47,589 --> 00:37:44,240
interested

1006
00:37:50,950 --> 00:37:47,599
in uh the whole idea of

1007
00:37:53,510 --> 00:37:50,960
of religion and the ufo phenomena and

1008
00:37:54,470 --> 00:37:53,520
and specifically because i know that uh

1009
00:37:58,069 --> 00:37:54,480
sean has

1010
00:38:02,630 --> 00:37:58,079
has done a lot of research on the uh um

1011
00:38:05,829 --> 00:38:02,640
uh betty anne reason lucas uh ufo cases

1012
00:38:08,950 --> 00:38:05,839
and uh you know this uh

1013
00:38:12,630 --> 00:38:08,960
has always uh been of interest to me

1014
00:38:15,829 --> 00:38:12,640
on um on how

1015
00:38:20,790 --> 00:38:15,839
her experiences have have really

1016
00:38:25,750 --> 00:38:23,109
almost like a religious uh movement

1017
00:38:27,510 --> 00:38:25,760
within the ufo community

1018
00:38:28,950 --> 00:38:27,520
well i believe in betty andreas and luca

1019
00:38:30,829 --> 00:38:28,960
i found out about her uh

1020
00:38:32,390 --> 00:38:30,839
reading with steven's book

1021
00:38:34,150 --> 00:38:32,400
transformation

1022
00:38:36,550 --> 00:38:34,160
the sequel to a communion he got the on

1023
00:38:38,710 --> 00:38:36,560
in the final pages here

1024
00:38:40,390 --> 00:38:38,720
he talked about uh betty andreas and

1025
00:38:41,670 --> 00:38:40,400
luca receiving this transmission from

1026
00:38:45,030 --> 00:38:41,680
the aliens

1027
00:38:46,470 --> 00:38:45,040
in a foreign language so she speaks

1028
00:38:48,230 --> 00:38:46,480
these words in the recording but no one

1029
00:38:49,990 --> 00:38:48,240
can understand them

1030
00:38:51,430 --> 00:38:50,000
and they finally translated i think it

1031
00:38:54,230 --> 00:38:51,440
was scott gaylin

1032
00:38:55,349 --> 00:38:54,240
ancient uh uh gaelic that she was

1033
00:38:56,870 --> 00:38:55,359
speaking in

1034
00:38:58,790 --> 00:38:56,880
and what she had to say sounded just

1035
00:39:00,710 --> 00:38:58,800
like a prophecy from nostradamus about

1036
00:39:02,470 --> 00:39:00,720
the northern peoples

1037
00:39:05,030 --> 00:39:02,480
knew the people of europe and and the

1038
00:39:06,470 --> 00:39:05,040
hard times they were going to endure

1039
00:39:07,670 --> 00:39:06,480
it's about judgment they were going to

1040
00:39:09,190 --> 00:39:07,680
enjoy this somehow they brought it on

1041
00:39:11,510 --> 00:39:09,200
themselves

1042
00:39:13,829 --> 00:39:11,520
so i mean she she was just touching on

1043
00:39:16,230 --> 00:39:13,839
things i had i previously already had

1044
00:39:18,630 --> 00:39:16,240
you know a certain amount of faith in

1045
00:39:20,390 --> 00:39:18,640
so so i i just thought of her instantly

1046
00:39:21,990 --> 00:39:20,400
as a kindred spirit something someone

1047
00:39:24,550 --> 00:39:22,000
who was in tune to the exact thing

1048
00:39:25,910 --> 00:39:24,560
i wanted to be in tune with so

1049
00:39:28,069 --> 00:39:25,920
eventually i was able to make contact

1050
00:39:29,750 --> 00:39:28,079
with her and interview her

1051
00:39:31,670 --> 00:39:29,760
but yeah she's been she's been essential

1052
00:39:33,349 --> 00:39:31,680
to my thinking for a long long time

1053
00:39:35,349 --> 00:39:33,359
willie says the same thing actually he

1054
00:39:36,790 --> 00:39:35,359
says that uh whenever he's feeling

1055
00:39:39,190 --> 00:39:36,800
depressed and down about

1056
00:39:41,270 --> 00:39:39,200
the abduction phenomenon he thinks about

1057
00:39:42,870 --> 00:39:41,280
betty andreas and luca

1058
00:39:44,710 --> 00:39:42,880
and it cheers and cheers him up a great

1059
00:39:48,790 --> 00:39:44,720
deal because he is you know sort of a

1060
00:39:55,109 --> 00:39:51,990
now i think that uh a lot of other uh

1061
00:39:55,990 --> 00:39:55,119
uh people within the the ufo community

1062
00:39:59,750 --> 00:39:56,000
have have kind

1063
00:40:03,109 --> 00:39:59,760
of looked down on her experiences

1064
00:40:05,270 --> 00:40:03,119
uh because of

1065
00:40:07,829 --> 00:40:05,280
what she has written about uh in her

1066
00:40:12,150 --> 00:40:07,839
books i mean you know

1067
00:40:14,230 --> 00:40:12,160
why do you think that a a lot of

1068
00:40:15,349 --> 00:40:14,240
investigators and researchers are are

1069
00:40:18,230 --> 00:40:15,359
more than happy

1070
00:40:19,270 --> 00:40:18,240
to consider the idea that uh you know

1071
00:40:20,790 --> 00:40:19,280
we're dealing with

1072
00:40:22,390 --> 00:40:20,800
you know strictly extraterrestrials from

1073
00:40:23,030 --> 00:40:22,400
outer space but then you have somebody

1074
00:40:24,550 --> 00:40:23,040
like

1075
00:40:26,230 --> 00:40:24,560
betty and her experiences and they're

1076
00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:26,240
just like oh no that's just complete

1077
00:40:29,270 --> 00:40:28,130
that's just crazy stuff

1078
00:40:30,790 --> 00:40:29,280
[Music]

1079
00:40:32,710 --> 00:40:30,800
i don't know i mean people just believe

1080
00:40:35,910 --> 00:40:32,720
it they believe whatever makes

1081
00:40:38,870 --> 00:40:35,920
makes them comfortable whatever

1082
00:40:39,510 --> 00:40:38,880
flatters their sense of self-esteem i

1083
00:40:41,750 --> 00:40:39,520
mean a lot

1084
00:40:43,030 --> 00:40:41,760
people have rejected uh religious faith

1085
00:40:46,069 --> 00:40:43,040
uh from maternity

1086
00:40:49,030 --> 00:40:46,079
down to the ages so i mean

1087
00:40:53,750 --> 00:40:49,040
it doesn't surprise me it doesn't really

1088
00:40:55,910 --> 00:40:53,760
it doesn't really discourage me

1089
00:40:57,510 --> 00:40:55,920
a buddy of mine from oklahoma once said

1090
00:40:58,710 --> 00:40:57,520
we would be asking about his views on

1091
00:41:01,510 --> 00:40:58,720
prophecy

1092
00:41:06,550 --> 00:41:01,520
he said well i'm a pan millennialist

1093
00:41:09,270 --> 00:41:07,670
you may not need to get much more

1094
00:41:10,550 --> 00:41:09,280
complicated than that ultimately maybe

1095
00:41:12,230 --> 00:41:10,560
just a simple

1096
00:41:17,030 --> 00:41:12,240
faith that it will all pan out in the

1097
00:41:20,390 --> 00:41:19,109
do you know offhand uh sean i mean is

1098
00:41:23,990 --> 00:41:20,400
she do

1099
00:41:25,349 --> 00:41:24,000
does she continue to have uh experiences

1100
00:41:27,190 --> 00:41:25,359
actually i haven't communicated with her

1101
00:41:27,990 --> 00:41:27,200
in a while last time myself through her

1102
00:41:31,349 --> 00:41:28,000
was i think

1103
00:41:33,510 --> 00:41:31,359
2015 2016.

1104
00:41:35,270 --> 00:41:33,520
so i i would not be surprised if she

1105
00:41:37,109 --> 00:41:35,280
continued having experiences but i

1106
00:41:38,790 --> 00:41:37,119
i would have no idea what they are yeah

1107
00:41:41,990 --> 00:41:38,800
yeah we've we tried to get her

1108
00:41:43,430 --> 00:41:42,000
on the the show and i know her health

1109
00:41:46,470 --> 00:41:43,440
has not been all that

1110
00:41:48,470 --> 00:41:46,480
great uh but i i do believe and maybe

1111
00:41:49,349 --> 00:41:48,480
i'm speaking out of turn that her

1112
00:41:52,870 --> 00:41:49,359
daughter

1113
00:41:56,150 --> 00:41:52,880
has had um some experiences

1114
00:41:57,589 --> 00:41:56,160
of her of her own yeah it definitely

1115
00:41:58,950 --> 00:41:57,599
runs in the family her daughter her

1116
00:42:01,109 --> 00:41:58,960
daughter becky wrote a whole book about

1117
00:42:03,910 --> 00:42:01,119
her experiences

1118
00:42:05,829 --> 00:42:03,920
apart from her mother that was separate

1119
00:42:07,910 --> 00:42:05,839
from betty's

1120
00:42:09,750 --> 00:42:07,920
now you you've done you you've done uh

1121
00:42:10,390 --> 00:42:09,760
had quite a bit of correspondence with

1122
00:42:14,069 --> 00:42:10,400
the

1123
00:42:16,230 --> 00:42:14,079
ray fowler who i i think was probably

1124
00:42:17,510 --> 00:42:16,240
responsible well you mentioned whitley

1125
00:42:19,510 --> 00:42:17,520
but i think uh

1126
00:42:21,829 --> 00:42:19,520
well fowler wrote the first uh he wrote

1127
00:42:23,750 --> 00:42:21,839
the first book on betty andreas right

1128
00:42:25,670 --> 00:42:23,760
right yeah the andreas affair which came

1129
00:42:29,030 --> 00:42:25,680
out on 1979.

1130
00:42:31,670 --> 00:42:29,040
yeah and does he not take a uh

1131
00:42:32,790 --> 00:42:31,680
a sort of a religious or metaphysical

1132
00:42:35,430 --> 00:42:32,800
approach to

1133
00:42:37,030 --> 00:42:35,440
the topic you know he does he went

1134
00:42:38,309 --> 00:42:37,040
through his own spiritual transformation

1135
00:42:39,510 --> 00:42:38,319
raymond fowler is very interesting in

1136
00:42:41,510 --> 00:42:39,520
those terms

1137
00:42:44,069 --> 00:42:41,520
he began to investigate betty back in

1138
00:42:46,950 --> 00:42:44,079
1977 when they did their first hypnotic

1139
00:42:48,390 --> 00:42:46,960
sessions together and at that time he

1140
00:42:50,309 --> 00:42:48,400
had no uh

1141
00:42:52,390 --> 00:42:50,319
not one inkling to the idea that he was

1142
00:42:55,349 --> 00:42:52,400
an abductee himself

1143
00:42:57,190 --> 00:42:55,359
it was only in later years when he had

1144
00:42:59,910 --> 00:42:57,200
certain recollections

1145
00:43:01,589 --> 00:42:59,920
uh-huh that he realized he was himself

1146
00:43:03,670 --> 00:43:01,599
and had the key

1147
00:43:06,790 --> 00:43:03,680
and and like it does to everybody it

1148
00:43:08,950 --> 00:43:06,800
changes your whole outlook on reality

1149
00:43:12,150 --> 00:43:08,960
what uh dr john mack our late harvard

1150
00:43:13,829 --> 00:43:12,160
psychiatrist called ontological shock

1151
00:43:15,670 --> 00:43:13,839
once you realize this is a real

1152
00:43:17,030 --> 00:43:15,680
experience you have to start reworking

1153
00:43:19,990 --> 00:43:17,040
everything you thought you knew about

1154
00:43:23,510 --> 00:43:22,550
so well i remember i remember ray fowler

1155
00:43:26,230 --> 00:43:23,520
did a

1156
00:43:27,109 --> 00:43:26,240
book that i have somewhere i hear in a

1157
00:43:29,990 --> 00:43:27,119
stack of

1158
00:43:30,870 --> 00:43:30,000
500 books on on synchronicities that's

1159
00:43:34,470 --> 00:43:30,880
kind of what

1160
00:43:36,950 --> 00:43:34,480
uh in impressed me about

1161
00:43:40,390 --> 00:43:36,960
him and of course uh he's he's done a

1162
00:43:41,270 --> 00:43:40,400
lot of very good solid uh research

1163
00:43:44,950 --> 00:43:41,280
including

1164
00:43:49,190 --> 00:43:44,960
uh the case so there in uh uh kingman uh

1165
00:43:51,069 --> 00:43:49,200
oh uh king in arizona uh the ufo crash

1166
00:43:54,710 --> 00:43:51,079
that goes back to the

1167
00:43:57,109 --> 00:43:54,720
19 late 1940's early 1950s

1168
00:43:58,069 --> 00:43:57,119
and we've had the historian harry drew

1169
00:44:01,349 --> 00:43:58,079
on the

1170
00:44:01,750 --> 00:44:01,359
program to talk about that uh a number

1171
00:44:04,309 --> 00:44:01,760
of

1172
00:44:04,870 --> 00:44:04,319
times a very exceptional case and if it

1173
00:44:08,069 --> 00:44:04,880
wasn't for

1174
00:44:08,790 --> 00:44:08,079
ray fowler uh we would not know about

1175
00:44:10,790 --> 00:44:08,800
that and

1176
00:44:12,069 --> 00:44:10,800
and probably not the better andreas in

1177
00:44:15,430 --> 00:44:12,079
the cases uh

1178
00:44:17,829 --> 00:44:15,440
as well now does she

1179
00:44:19,829 --> 00:44:17,839
subscribe to the theory that uh the

1180
00:44:23,030 --> 00:44:19,839
aliens that she's in touch with

1181
00:44:25,910 --> 00:44:23,040
uh are part of some uh

1182
00:44:27,750 --> 00:44:25,920
religious phenomena or how does she uh

1183
00:44:29,510 --> 00:44:27,760
incorporate the two

1184
00:44:31,109 --> 00:44:29,520
i believe she believes that the graves

1185
00:44:34,309 --> 00:44:31,119
that abductor are angelic

1186
00:44:36,550 --> 00:44:34,319
uh beings the very first her very first

1187
00:44:38,630 --> 00:44:36,560
consciously uh uh recalled that last

1188
00:44:40,710 --> 00:44:38,640
year she called it under hypnosis

1189
00:44:42,150 --> 00:44:40,720
but the first event of her is that they

1190
00:44:44,230 --> 00:44:42,160
explored in depth

1191
00:44:46,309 --> 00:44:44,240
took place in her home in massachusetts

1192
00:44:49,190 --> 00:44:46,319
in 1967.

1193
00:44:50,470 --> 00:44:49,200
about 10 years before she lived under

1194
00:44:51,990 --> 00:44:50,480
hypnosis

1195
00:44:53,349 --> 00:44:52,000
and one of the first things they said to

1196
00:44:54,870 --> 00:44:53,359
betty the great aliens one of the first

1197
00:44:56,630 --> 00:44:54,880
things they said to her was christ is

1198
00:44:59,910 --> 00:44:56,640
coming soon

1199
00:45:01,030 --> 00:44:59,920
ah okay so i mean i obviously

1200
00:45:03,990 --> 00:45:01,040
they were they were letting her know

1201
00:45:07,990 --> 00:45:04,000
where they stood on that subject

1202
00:45:10,870 --> 00:45:08,000
now did was she uh particularly really

1203
00:45:13,190 --> 00:45:10,880
was her background one of a deeply

1204
00:45:15,510 --> 00:45:13,200
spiritual or religious person

1205
00:45:18,230 --> 00:45:15,520
yes yes he was he was a believer she was

1206
00:45:21,270 --> 00:45:18,240
a devout christian before the experience

1207
00:45:24,470 --> 00:45:21,280
so that that must have had a uh maybe a

1208
00:45:26,470 --> 00:45:24,480
a deeper impact on her that

1209
00:45:27,990 --> 00:45:26,480
these things were happening to her and

1210
00:45:30,630 --> 00:45:28,000
they didn't quite

1211
00:45:31,190 --> 00:45:30,640
fit into the scope of what she might

1212
00:45:35,829 --> 00:45:31,200
have been

1213
00:45:38,309 --> 00:45:35,839
raised to believe as far as christianity

1214
00:45:39,430 --> 00:45:38,319
goes and and and the faith you know

1215
00:45:42,069 --> 00:45:39,440
concept of

1216
00:45:44,230 --> 00:45:42,079
uh what we have is a bit you know in the

1217
00:45:46,390 --> 00:45:44,240
bible and so forth but uh

1218
00:45:47,430 --> 00:45:46,400
you you've covered the the subject uh

1219
00:45:50,630 --> 00:45:47,440
sean pretty well in

1220
00:45:53,030 --> 00:45:50,640
in your uh uh work and uh

1221
00:45:54,710 --> 00:45:53,040
this this book that we just recently uh

1222
00:45:58,390 --> 00:45:54,720
came out with is just the

1223
00:46:00,230 --> 00:45:58,400
uh phenomenal uh uh undertaking

1224
00:46:02,390 --> 00:46:00,240
and also to the psychic and ufo

1225
00:46:05,510 --> 00:46:02,400
revelations for the 21st century

1226
00:46:08,470 --> 00:46:05,520
now that takes more of a ufological

1227
00:46:09,990 --> 00:46:08,480
uh approach uh as seen through the eyes

1228
00:46:13,589 --> 00:46:10,000
of the astronaut command

1229
00:46:16,870 --> 00:46:13,599
and the space brothers uh as opposed to

1230
00:46:17,829 --> 00:46:16,880
this book on ufos and signs in the

1231
00:46:22,150 --> 00:46:17,839
symbols

1232
00:46:26,390 --> 00:46:22,160
which is a more of a uh a non-sectarian

1233
00:46:27,910 --> 00:46:26,400
at work on a biblical phenomenon

1234
00:46:29,430 --> 00:46:27,920
tim we have about a minute left in the

1235
00:46:31,190 --> 00:46:29,440
show

1236
00:46:32,790 --> 00:46:31,200
all right well i want to thank sean for

1237
00:46:35,270 --> 00:46:32,800
coming on and uh

1238
00:46:36,710 --> 00:46:35,280
i want to thank all our listeners again

1239
00:46:38,710 --> 00:46:36,720
for the well wishes that they

1240
00:46:39,750 --> 00:46:38,720
they sent me and don't forget our

1241
00:46:42,790 --> 00:46:39,760
youtube

1242
00:46:44,150 --> 00:46:42,800
channel which is mr ufo's secret defiled

1243
00:46:46,069 --> 00:46:44,160
we're a little bit behind but we're

1244
00:46:47,750 --> 00:46:46,079
going to uh be

1245
00:46:49,349 --> 00:46:47,760
catching up and we've got some

1246
00:46:50,470 --> 00:46:49,359
tremendous books that have just come out

1247
00:46:53,270 --> 00:46:50,480
and we've got

1248
00:46:53,910 --> 00:46:53,280
quite a few and new ones in the works

1249
00:46:56,069 --> 00:46:53,920
well

1250
00:46:57,270 --> 00:46:56,079
that's all the wishes for my tonight a

1251
00:47:00,470 --> 00:46:57,280
very unusual event

1252
00:47:01,030 --> 00:47:00,480
so i apologize for that it's it's the

1253
00:47:07,430 --> 00:47:01,040
devil

1254
00:47:11,030 --> 00:47:07,440
yeah good night all right thank you guys

1255
00:47:13,109 --> 00:47:11,040
thank you

1256
00:47:14,470 --> 00:47:13,119
you've been listening to exploring the

1257
00:47:17,190 --> 00:47:14,480
bazaar

1258
00:47:18,710 --> 00:47:17,200
with hosts timothy beckley and tim

1259
00:47:20,870 --> 00:47:18,720
schwartz

1260
00:47:23,190 --> 00:47:20,880
they're taking back the night by jetting

1261
00:47:25,270 --> 00:47:23,200
non-stop across the cosmos

1262
00:47:27,030 --> 00:47:25,280
in search of the truly bizarre and

1263
00:47:30,390 --> 00:47:27,040
totally unexplained

1264
00:47:32,870 --> 00:47:30,400
with you as their coal miners thursday

1265
00:47:36,069 --> 00:47:32,880
nights at 7 p.m pacific

1266
00:47:38,710 --> 00:47:36,079
10 p.m eastern on the kcor

1267
00:47:41,589 --> 00:47:38,720
digital radio network for more

1268
00:47:43,750 --> 00:47:41,599
information on exploring the bazaars

1269
00:47:46,549 --> 00:47:43,760
and hosts timothy beckley and tim

1270
00:47:48,630 --> 00:47:46,559
schwartz check out their kcor digital

1271
00:47:51,829 --> 00:47:48,640
radio network

1272
00:47:55,670 --> 00:47:51,839
follow their youtube channel at

1273
00:48:06,290 --> 00:47:55,680
ufo 1100 exploring